My Palette 2 Pro seems confused, splicing the wrong colour.

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40 comments

  • Avatar
    Steve Lionel

    Using CANVAS to slice? This is a very common problem - I've seen it multiple times. Chroma seems less prone to this. I don't know if it's entirely a slicer issue or is some flaw in the P2's programming.

  • Avatar
    Benoit Valin

    Yes, using Canvas.

    When reprinting the same project and the same parts in different projects

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hey Benoit, even if you're finding a few layers switching, I would still save the calibration values for this print as the overall calibration is fine. By saving these values, Palette has a larger sample size to learn from, rather than not saving the values and having no values to learn from. For subsequent prints, I would only save the calibration values if the calibration of the print is better than the previous print.

  • Avatar
    Benoit Valin

    Is there like an expected period when the palette won't do this anymore? I don't really need 25 earbud holders and i really don't want to risk a 40 hour print job to find it all confused and waste kilos of filament. Please advise.

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Hello,

    I think I'm in the same situation.
    It's been 2 weeks since I tried unsuccessfully to have correct impressions after the successful key 2 colors ... without success real
    That's a lot of tests, filament and time.
    For my part, Palette 2 never asks me for a note after printing. He just wants to know whether to register or not.
    Since yesterday, I save every time, but it does not seem to improve (photos) and it's even the opposite I find (from left to right from first to last + the one in court).
    I calibrated and I left zero many times but it becomes painful.

    I would like an adviser. Thank you

    (I specify I use: S3D + Chroma + Octoprint with Plug in on a modified CR-10S)

  • Avatar
    Benoit Valin

    I'm starting to think it's a problem with the model, because i printed other multi colour calibration models, 2-3-4 colours and there were no mixups. 

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    I do not know if it's the model.
    Here is my test today (6h print)
    It's really strange, at one point it slips and then it comes back.

    I saved the impression. I do not know if it's a good idea. By cons no note never asked as I could read.

     

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hey Picaboubx, sorry to hear about the issues that you're seeing recently. Would you happen to have the pings from this most recent print? Pings compare the amount of filament used vs. what is expected to be used at certain points of a print, and can provide us with information about the overall calibration of your Palette and printer (http://mm3d.co/ping-pong). You can find a history of pings during a print by clicking the menu button on Palette's screen (lower right corner) and selecting Ping Offsets. This will provide us with an overall story of your print's calibration.

    Also, could you possibly share a picture of your keychain calibration model and the bottom of the transition tower? This could also provide additional information about the calibration of your printer/Palette (http://mm3d.co/newkeychain-troubleshooting).

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Hello,

    I can not see the history of the last print on Palette 2. I think it's because the print is done. I do not have a button "Pings Offsets".
    By cons I enclose the following 2 screenshots which are the export data from Chroma and final result after printing indicated in Palette de Octoprint.
    I hope it does not help you anyway.
    I have another long impression in the week, I will try to make a return on the ping in the printing yard.

     

     

    I also attach 2 photos of my last Keychain (front and back) with transition tower.

     

     

    (Sorry for my English. This is a Google translation.)

     

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hey Picaboubx, no need to apologize, your English is great! Thank you for this information. Your calibration print and transition tower look fine, but based on the last ping of your print (~106%), it looks like your printer is extruding more than expected. Because of this, I would offer running an extruder calibration to ensure that the flow of filament from your nozzle is consistent. We find that this guide is helpful to try and adjust this: https://mattshub.com/2017/04/19/extruder-calibration/

     

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Good evening (from France ;-))

    Will I have to do a full calibration again after that?

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Good evening! Yes, once the extruder calibration is done, please re-run the calibration process: http://mm3d.co/calibration-troubleshooting

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Good evening,

    So after your advice I redid the calibration of the extruder of my CR-10S.
    He needed it.
    So I redid all the calibration phase of Palette 2.
    Everything went well for key 2 and 4 colors. Perfect impressions. (See photos and pings)

     

    Then I tried 2 earbuds.
    The, everything is almost good but each time 1 or 2 layers plants the color.
    I then said I tried something else to make the Palette learn.
    I tried a globe.
    The still 2 defects appeared.
    (See photos and Ping)

    https://youtu.be/Kay2jhxBXmk 

    I tested another model
    who started on a melenge disaster of color and so I quit.
    (See photos and Ping)

     

    So I start getting tired of this calibration procedure that does not succeed. I must have more than 30 impressions since the beginning. It's long.

    I do not understand why it gets worse when it started well.

    At the moment I write this message, I have an Earbud in court that has still missed 3 or 4 layers at the time of the color.

    So no improvement.

    Help :-(

  • Avatar
    Benoit Valin

    I really doubt that it's a calibration problem, since if it was calibration we'd see colour bleeding in the examples above. What we are seeing is colour switching, where instead of #2 it takes #3, while remaining perfectly transitioned. 

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    I quite agree with you Benoit.
    There is another problem, a bug somewhere.
    It is strange that some layers are missed while the majorities are good.

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Hello,

    New test with a small cube of test with 4 colors superimposed rotating on levels of different heights.

    Once again in the first layer and in the last certain color are found in the wrong places
    (Photos and ping below)


    On the other hand, I do not know if I should record this kind of impression ... or not?

    I also noticed that 2 out of 3 Palette 2 remains stuck at launch via octoprint on the initialization screen below.

    I have to restart it 1, 2 or 3 times to get a normal start.
    If I "force" the start by clicking on the "Clear Palette" button in the "Palette 2" menu under Octoprint, the colors that are prepared in the filament are great no matter what.
    There is therefore a problem of initialization.

     

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    I also specify that the Palette 2 never asks me to note the impression, but just if I want to record it.

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hey Picaboubx, I'm sorry that you're experiencing this issue. Are you running any other plugins in OctoPrint besides the Palette and CANVAS plugins? This could be causing the initializing issues that you're seeing. If possible, please turn off all other plugins except for the Palette and CANVAS plugins.

    Concerning the streaking issues, could you please trying to slightly lower your print speed and trying the print again?

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Good evening,

    Following your advice I tried the slower speed 45mm/s is 55mm/s
    it's the same :-(

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hey Picaboubx, I'm sorry that you're still seeing this issue. If the speed is not helping, we're also found that the filament length can help to avoid this. What is your current transition length? If possible, please set this to 80 mm or more. Also, could you please print multiples of the earbud? This would also help to increase your filament length.

    We do apologize for this, Picaboubx. Please know that we are working hard to solve this issue. Currently, we believe that we've isolated the reason for these errors, but will need to complete extensive testing to ensure that it doesn't affect other areas of Palette/calibration. We appreciate your patience!

  • Avatar
    Kurt Skauen

    I have the same problem now. A 3 color model that I have printed successfully before is now consistently skipping one of the colors early on in the print. It goes back and forth through the 3 colors like black, white, gold, white, black, white, gold, white, black, ... It start the first layer with white, so the purge block looks like this: (white-black, black-gold) + (gold-white,white-black) + (black-white, white-gold) + (gold-white, white-black) + (black-white, white-gold). 

    Then after ~10 layers it do (gold-white, white-white) + (white-white, white-gold) + (gold-white, white-black). All pings up to the points where it fail (and beyond) oscillate around 100% deviating ~0.5% in each directions. All transitions hit the target position on the purge block pretty well. It just suddenly decide to swap one of the black segments with a (still perfectly sized) white segment.

    Then it randomly repeats this later in the print. The first time this happened it swapped another black section with white followed closely by swapping a white section with black before completing the rest without more errors. The next time I printed it the first failure was exactly like in the first print, but it had many more (~12) swaps during the rest of the print.

    No bleeding as if it was missing the target position on the purge block, just clean swaps.

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hi Kurt, sorry to hear that you're running into this issue. Could you please share a picture of your print along with the ping values? As mentioned previously, we are working to help solve these issues where the colors swap and expect to have a firmware update released sometime next week.

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Good evening,

    I come back after a few days without a printer due to faulty temperature sensor.

    Tonight, I restarted the test Multi-Color_Earbud_Case by printing x 3 at once.

    Before that, Octoprint asked me to update the Canvas and Palette2 Plugins, which I did.
    At the time I launched this impression, the update of the new Firmwire of Palette 2 itself was not done yet.

    So I started printing just to see if my random-layer problems were still there with more filament to print.

    So the first Ping were not really good news because over 109%


    But I let it go ... to see
    Ping did not settle and even exceeded 110%.
    But here is the result is just perfect, nothing to say it is without errors.
    I do not understand how this is possible given the pings.


    I put the timelapse to you to realize the impression from the beginning to the end.

    https://youtu.be/IiIaGbcZBlk 

    I updated the Pallete 2 just after printing and I will continue in the coming days with other larger and more complex prints to validate the fealability.

    I'm pretty happy for now because I was starting to wonder if it would work one day.

    I will soon make a return on my chain of this product which has for me a huge potential.

    See you soon, thank you.

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    a small picture of the result

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Thanks for this information, Picaboubx! Even if the pings are not 100%, the calibration can still be fine as Palette is constantly trying to learn more about your printer and adjust the splices that it creates. Even with larger pings, this tells Palette that your printer is using more filament than expected, but it will still work to get these pings as close to 100% as possible. Please save these calibration values, as this allows Palette to have a larger sample size to learn from.

    Also, awesome time-lapse and printer/Palette setup! Please let us know if you ever have any other questions.

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Hello,

    After a few days without being able to take care of it I came back since the beginning of the week on the calibration of my CR-10S which I thought to be finalized after my last impression of 3 earbuds (see previous post).

    After that I had made all the updates.

    Since the devut week I tried without success to make a correct impression.

    So I left again, at the base of the calibration.

    Tonight, I admit that I get tired of this procedure that does not lead to a conclusive result.

    In the order of the photos below:

    1 - First impression after reset of Palette 2: Seems perfect but in 2 colors only

    2 - second impression in 4 colors: no result

    3 - same model as 2 but in 300% height to increase the amount of filament: The top and the bottom are good but the intermediate layers are random.

    4 - Same model as the 3 to see if the Palette has learned from the previous version: Same result as 3 so with zero intermediate layers.


    I can provide you for information the lists of Ping for the tests 1, 2 and 4

    If you have advice I am a taker, but since my purchase the filament quatity used and my time for trying to operate this material have become too important. I'm disappointed.

    (For information too: in the latest version of the Palette 2 plugin for Octoprint, the intelligent filament loading function does not work at home.)

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Bonsoir,

    Mon post est toujours en attente de validation.
    Y a t'il un problème?

    Cordialement

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hi Picaboubx, could you please share your pings for these prints? Also, after completing each print, are you saving the calibration values? Although the prints are not perfect, Palette does need to learn from your calibration values in order to adjust properly for your printer. By saving your calibration values each time, Palette will adjust the HM so that it can follow the calibration of your printer.

    Concerning the intelligent filament loading, what issues are you seeing? Does it over/under load the filament?

  • Avatar
    Picaboubx

    Good evening,

    FYI, my post is still waiting for validation!

    I attach the screenshots of my pings export (1, 2 and 4)

    I record all the impressions.

    I repeat all the calibration procedure 2 times last week after 4 or 5 unsuccessful impressions.

    The only thing I have not done since my problem with the problem is that it is a new calibration of the printer because I do not think that it is useful.

    For the intelligent loading function, I have a message that appears which I do not have the memory anymore (I will put it to you on the occasion of my next impression). But anyway when I press the button nothing happens, no loading.

  • Avatar
    Jonny Yeu

    Hi Picaboubx, thanks for sharing this information with us. Taking a look at your pings, it looks like your printer is extruding inconsistently, which is causing the issues in your print. Since a Ping compares the actual amount of filament used versus the expected amount used at that point, we can see that the actual amount of filament extruded throughout the print varies by quite a lot. There’s a few things that I’d like to check with you:

    • A clog in the nozzle can cause the amount of filament extruded to vary. Cleaning the nozzle may help with this.
    • An extruder calibration may help to ensure that your printer is extruding consistently. We’ve found that running this with our CR-10 has helped, especially if you’re using the stock extruder.
    • Are you using another nozzle size besides 0.4 mm?
    • Were these tests also run at 45-55 mm/sec?
    • We just released a new plugin update (V2.1.1) that should help with the Intelligent Loading function.

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